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Dancing in Mid Air

04/25/2005 - James White

   I was just writing a note to my friend Steve Camp when I saw an article pop up on Dave Armstrong's blog. He was talking about Dobson appearing on Hannity & Colmes and being asked about Al Mohler's 2000 statement about Rome being a false church (amen!) with a false gospel (amen again). (Just in case you haven't noticed, that conclusion is no longer allowable in public discourse, though, of course, it was widely represented amongst the Founding Fathers of this nation.) Dobson's response illustrates once again what happens once you abandon the gospel as the sole means of changing the heart (and hence society):
DOBSON: Well, first of all, he [Mohler] did not make a vehement anti-Catholic statement. He's a Southern Baptist, for Pete's sake. You expect a Southern Baptist to say that he does not honor the pope in the same way the Catholics do. It's a different theology. Is that not right? That's not an attack on the Catholic Church.
   Excuse me? How can any rational person switch "false church/false gospel" into "You expect a Southern Baptist to say that he does not honor the pope in the same way the Catholics do"? Those are not even slightly equivalent statements. Honor the pope the same way Catholics do? No kidding! Can you imagine if someone dared to read the language of the WCF/LBCF regarding the Pope as the man of sin? Goodness, you'd probably be arrested.
   Let's be real clear here. Al Mohler was right in 2000. Rome is a false church. Why? Because Christ's Church is subject to Christ's Word, and Rome is not. Because Christ's Church presents Christ's gospel, and Rome does not. And Rome's gospel cannot save because it tears the very heart out of the gospel and replaces it with a semi-Pelagian treadmill of sacramental forgiveness---or, in lots of places in the world today, has dumped that for an inclusivistic/universalistic mishmash of New Age philosophy and post-modernism that would make Pope Pius IX spit nails. In any case, the gospel of grace has been anathematized by Rome---and thrown under the bus by pseudo-evangelicals, but it remains the only power of God unto salvation.

21:36:50 - Category: Roman Catholicism - Link to this article -


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More Mary Stains

04/20/2005 - James White

   You know, I would like to see some of the major figures in Roman Catholicism, the "out front" guys, the ones who promote Rome as infallible, her Pope as the head of the church, etc., just once come out and say, "Look, people, this kind of thing is absurd and ridiculous. Pure superstition, idolatrous, and worthy of at the very least church discipline." But no, you won't hear that. Instead, you'll hear, "Well, looks like a rather common water stain mixed with the salt from the road on an underpass, but hey, if it gives you warm post-modern religious fuzzies, that's great!"
   We hear all the time from RC apologists, "Oh, Marian devotion does not detract from Christ at all! Mary is our path to Jesus." Well, if that is true, and Mary leads everyone to Jesus, why are all these folks finding pictures of Mary in the grimy stains left by reconstituted water (Clearwater Florida bank window, remember?) or salt-filled road run off on a freeway underpass? Where is someone's mind if they can look at this stain and go, "Oh gosh, Mary has appeared under a bridge!" What on earth is she doing under a bridge? Western culture is on the slippery slope of post-modernism, sliding at high speed toward self-destruction, and Mary is busily arranging salt stains on a bridge underpass near Chicago? Hello? Anyone out there? No, Marian devotion does detract from devotion to Christ and to His Lordship in life. As I said in Mary--Another Redeemer?, a person who believes they need a mediator with the Mediator simply does not know the Mediator to begin with. And in case you haven't read that book, allow me a single quote to illustrate the kind of "piety" that leads people to light candles in front of water stains on the walls of freeway underpasses: ...
[Click Here to Continue Reading]

12:04:31 - Category: Roman Catholicism - Link to this article -


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A Quote from the New Pope, Benedict XVI

04/19/2005 - James White

We shall break off at this point, for the chief goal of our considerations has been attained. We have seen that the New Testament as a whole strikingly demonstrates the primacy of Peter; we have seen that the formative development of tradition and of the Church supposed the continuation of Peter's authority in Rome as an intrinsic condition. The Roman primacy is not an invention of the popes, but an essential element of ecclesial unity that goes back to the Lord and was developed faithfully in the nascent Church.
   How would you respond? Where would you go for resources? How would you argue your case?
   The writings of Ratzinger, now Benedict XVI, are a rich storehouse of the most modern, up-to-date expressions of Roman Catholic theology and, since he has been for so long the Prefect of the Congregation for the Doctrine of the Faith in Rome (aka, the modern embodiment of the Inquisition), he is, by nature, an apologist: inwardly, and outwardly (but maybe, in a sense, more inwardly than outwardly). Therefore, his writings are significantly "easier" to interact with--they are laid out in such a fashion as to actually make a point and seek to do so with logical arguments. He is careful with his words--one debater can recognize another, and Ratzinger has debated. Maybe not so much publicly as in the halls of the Vatican as the chief "enforcer" of theology for Rome. Oh what I could do with a ton of time to dig through his writings! Well, enough for now....

22:02:58 - Category: Roman Catholicism - Link to this article -


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Quick Thoughts

04/19/2005 - James White

   I monitor nearly 30 blogs these days, thanks to the Sage plug in for Firefox, and some of them are already listing the "Pope-bashing" going on after the election of Benedict XVI. I couldn't help but be struck by the irony of the situation. I just saw a leftist blog using all kinds of profanity while mocking Ratzinger's German heritage. It is simply disgusting. Our readers know you can come to Pros Apologian and you will never be assaulted by profanity or that kind of behavior. And yet, if I factually and carefully document the vast difference between the gospel of grace and that of Roman Catholicism, critics respond with the same kind of venom currently being spewed at the new Pope. Odd, isn't it?
   I stand firmly against the teachings of Joseph Ratzinger, now Pope Benedict XVI. But the idea of mocking his heritage, his name, as if this were serious apologetic argumentation---outlandish! If you are going to oppose the man, oppose what he teaches, and do so accurately! For example, if I wish to address Benedict XVI's views on Mary, I have here in my library his work, Daughter of Zion (Ignatius, 1983). Quote the man, do so fairly, in context, and then provide a reasoned argument against what he says. At times these days I wonder if I've been transported to another planet given how rarely anyone argues that way anymore.
   On a completely different topic, just saw that reformedcatholicism.com is closing down. I can't help but point out that this experiment failed mainly because you can't create any kind of meaningful unity when you can't define truth. It's just not possible, and getting a bunch of folks together who only share a common commitment to the undefinability of truth isn't going to create long-term stability.

15:26:35 - Category: Roman Catholicism - Link to this article -


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Paul Owen: Leading Defender of Roman Catholicism

04/18/2005 - James White

   Dave Armstrong has it right: Dr. Paul Owen of Montreat College is, in fact, one of the best friends the Roman Catholic apologetics community has ever come across. It is always good to have folks "inside" the other camp to come to your aid, sort of like a fifth column ("men will arise from your own ranks"). The tactic is as old as the hills. Note Armstrong's glee:
Great article by our friend, Reformed professor Dr. Paul Owen: Five Reasons Why Paul's Anathemas Against the Judaizers in Galatians 1:8-9 Do Not Apply to Our Roman Catholic Brethren Read it! Master it! Share the information with your anti-Catholic buddies who don't understand this. You never know what effect you might have in the long run.
   And, not overly surprisingly, the article is hosted by TGE (is this all starting to make sense?).
   I have been waiting for Owen to put his theory in a form that can actually be addressed. He proposed his rather unique viewpoints on the NTRMin web board months ago. I got the impression he was going to publish his views. So this is either a summary of a longer article to come (this seems far too short for Owen), or he hasn't found anyone interested in his particular views. In any case, Eric Svendsen has already critiqued elements of this view, but I have been waiting for something more concrete. As the issues are grave, a response is necessary; but for the same reason, one will not be rushed. I will offer, for the moment, the following observation: the center of Owen's argument is that it was part and parcel of the Judaizer's position that the death of Christ was not necessary to salvation. He is quite right that Paul makes this very point in Galatians 2:20-21, but where he has completely missed the text (and surely, the insightful comments on Galatians provided by great men of the past) is that this is not Paul repeating, or summarizing, their arguments, but it is part of his argument. That is, the Judaizers would never dream of attempting to stay in the church while denying the necessity of Christ's death, for that was central to the public profession of the church itself (Gal. 3:1). Paul's argument shows Owen's is backwards: his argument is that the Judaizers are, by joining human actions and works with faith (Gal. 3:2), nullifying the grace of God and making the death of Christ of no effect. This isn't an argument if you as one of the Judaizers are already preaching that very thing! But it is an argument if it is showing that your confession and teaching are self-contradictory. It is very clear to the exegete-sans-ecumenical-agenda that Galatians 5:1-4 likewise undermines Owen's thesis, for Paul's concern is that the Galatians stand firm, not in defense of the necessity of the cross (a given), but in resisting being "subject again to a yoke of slavery." And what is the essence of this "yoke"? Verse two tells us that if they take that first step down the road of legalism, that first step in joining to the faith that everyone in Galatia claimed to have, including the Judaizers, any element of human action, law-keeping, etc., would place them outside the realm of Christ's grace (which, the Judaizers were obviously claiming to be in) and Christ would be of no benefit to them (showing again that they were not denying the necessity of a "benefit" from Christ---they were claiming faith in Christ, but were adding to what it takes to receive from Christ the fulness of salvation). These are observations that exegetes have made for many centuries, and only a strong desire to remove the multitudes of additions to faith dogmatically taught by Rome as the means of justification can explain Owen's viewpoint.

15:19:42 - Category: Roman Catholicism - Link to this article -


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The Conclave Begins

04/18/2005 - James White

   I'm not going to be placing any bets on who the next Pope will be, nor how quickly he will be chosen. I only predict that someone will say "Habemus Papam" and the gathered crowd will cheer and the fellow will bless the crowd in a less-than-perfect fitting papal outfit. How's that for going out on a limb?
   In case anyone hasn't noticed, this doesn't look much like how things were done back in the days of the Apostles. You'll hear all about all the "ancient traditions" here, but the fact of the matter is, the bishop of Rome was chosen by the people of Rome for a very, very long time. But don't tell the folks at FOX News. I guess the "two thousand year tradition" line has been written into every other newscast.
   I will surely be watching with interest. Ratzinger would be quite the choice. You do realize that he heads up the modern incarnation of the Inquisition, yes? Not quite the organization it once was, but that would be ironic, to be sure. But far more interesting, to me, anyway, would be Carlo Maria Martini, S.J., Archbishop Emeritus of Milan. Why? Because he is one of the editors of the United Bible Societies' Greek New Testament (4th Revised ed.). The King James Only folks (aka, Jack Chick, Ruckman, Riplinger, etc.) would have a spasm over his election as Pope. Either he or Ratzinger would keep the conspiracy mills going for quite some time.

01:00:00 - Category: Roman Catholicism - Link to this article -


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To the Catholic "Scholastic" on PlanetEnvoy

04/16/2005 - James White

   Just saw this, wanted to offer a response, and to once again invite "Scholastic" to join us on the Dividing Line. Might not work this Tuesday AM, as we hope to have Marty Minto as our guest, but surely on Thursday. 877-753-3341. Here's the comment:
How many times does James White have to paint caricatures of his Catholic opponents? (As a challenge to White enthusiasts, show me one Catholic opponent that White hasnt portrayed in an extremely negative light)
   Easy: Mitch Pacwa. Now, care to answer to the documentation I provided regarding the moderator of the board you are posting on, years ago, at this URL? :-) ...
[Click Here to Continue Reading]

20:00:48 - Category: Roman Catholicism - Link to this article -


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Some More on the WORD-FM/Salem Firing of Marty Minto

04/15/2005 - James White

   Ask if Rome's gospel is biblical and what happens to you on certain radio networks? Well, we've found out. I imagine Marty would have gotten away with it if he had done just one program, but as I've discovered, in essence, if you believe Romans 1:16 is true; and if you believe Galatians condemns false gospels, and if you think it is a really bad thing for an apostle to tell you, "Christ will be of no benefit to you," then the combined viewpoint of Rome and the majority of pseudo-evangelicalism is, "Shut up!" "Keep it to yourself!" "We don't want to hear it!" The Church has become Protestants (what a silly word to keep using) and Rome. That is what you must now believe to be "loving and kind."
   First, Jason Engwer has posted some interesting information about this situation at the NTRMIN web board. Here's the link. I'll be asking Marty about this stuff next week, Lord willing.
   Secondly, hearing the WORD-FM folks talking about the "whole church" and "all Christians" made me think about a distinction Rome itself makes (and about which, I assume, most radio station managers are ignorant). While we as "separated brethren" (to use the post-Vatican II lingo) can be considered "Christians" due to our baptism, our churches are not truly churches. That seems to miss the attention of most. There is no equality here. Rome is the Church. We are "communities" or, when certain bodies are referred to, Churches, but only in so far as we mirror elements of Rome. Rome is the Mother. The wonderfully fuzzy ecumenical feeling that says "let's just all get together" does not seem to understand that for Rome, we can indeed get together: in Rome. Think that is just old-time Catholicism? Ut Unum Sint from May of 1995 says this: ...
[Click Here to Continue Reading]

00:44:00 - Category: Roman Catholicism - Link to this article -


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Quick Update: Marty Minto Rescheduled

04/14/2005 - James White

   I sort of expected this would happen, and in fact, I'm happy it has, in a sense. Marty has been swamped with requests for interviews, and is driving to do a television interview even now, so he won't be able to join us on the DL until next Tuesday morning. Pray for him as he has a unique opportunity to speak to an important issue. I will be addressing the topic anyway and taking your calls.

15:29:15 - Category: Roman Catholicism - Link to this article -


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WORD-FM in Pittsburgh Fires Marty Minto (UPDATE!)

04/14/2005 - James White

   Some of you will remember the name Marty Minto. I was filling in for Marty when I interviewed Dave Hunt in 2000 regarding Calvinism. I was on Marty's show many times. In fact, it was a debate on Marty's show on KPXQ here in Phoenix that eventually led to the writing of The Same Sex Controversy. Marty left the area three or four years ago, and is pastoring out in Pennsylvania, but he also went to work at WORD FM hosting another talk program.
   I hope I had a positive influence on Marty. At least in one area it seems I did. Check this link out. WORD FM, a Salem Radio Network station, let Marty go after he raised the issue of whether the Pope went to heaven! What an amazing thing! I mean, good grief, Roman Catholic theology itself raises that question, but so-called "evangelicalism" cannot even allow the question to be raised, let alone discussed in a meaningful fashion! What an incredible insight into just how far "evangelicalism" has fallen from the evangel! More on this soon, as I'm really trying to get hold of Marty to invite him to be with me on the DL. I would love to talk to the folks who fired him as well, but I sorta doubt that is going to happen.
   UPDATE! As of 3pm EDT, Marty Minto is scheduled to join me on the DL this evening. He is, as you can imagine, a bit busy today doing interviews, but I have known Marty for years, and more than once dropped what I was doing to join him in studio, so I'm hoping not to get trumped by Nightline or something. :-) 877-753-3341 is the toll free number to call to talk to Marty and myself. It will be fun to have him on the other end of the microphone, so to speak, having been interviewed by him so many times! Be listening this afternoon/evening, 7pm EDT, 4pm PDT (and, of course, 4pm MST, the only time that doesn't change!).

10:13:35 - Category: Roman Catholicism - Link to this article -


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I Run Afoul of The Internet Monk and His...Folks

04/14/2005 - James White

   I depend a lot on folks out there to send me url's and notes about who is saying what, and maybe the fact that it was not till today that anyone mentioned the "Internet Monk's" comments says something, I don't know. I guess the Internet Monk is a former Baptist, former Calvinist, now in that wonderful world similar to the rC's where you can glibly say that you have "differences and disagreements" with Rome but you must never, never allow those mere, trifling disagreements to become definitional of the faith. Everyone has differences, but nobody finds those differences to be of such a nature as to allow anyone to speak of such a thing as a "false gospel." The shrinking of the definition of "the gospel" down to "a very basic Trinitarian confession---but, you don't really have to understand it, just as long as you don't confess something non-Trinitarian---that includes something about faith, without getting real specific, is more than enough" continues on in some circles, it seems. Evidently, believing Rome's gospel is false---beyond anything the Judaizers ever dreamed of, is a mortal sin for those involved in the "we still say we believe in the doctrines of grace we just don't want to accept what they mean" movement. Here are some of the more...interesting comments I ran across.
Be a real evangelical.
James White is laying down the line in the sand for evangelicals who will comment on the impending/recent death of the Pope (depending on who you are reading right now.) This is an example. Apparently, any evangelical who doesn't point out all the relevant errors of the Roman Catholic Church at the time of the death of the pope is a weenie.
I'm gonna be a weenie.
When Billy Graham goes, send me a list of the Catholic web sites that announce his apostasy from the true church.
...
[Click Here to Continue Reading]

02:00:00 - Category: Roman Catholicism - Link to this article -


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Steve Ray Didn't Send the Troops

04/11/2005 - James White

   So Steve Ray writes to me and asks me to correct my blog since he didn't "send any troops." Well, we don't want anyone confused! Of course, I didn't say he did, I said the folks who were sending us e-mails came from his board, but he disavows any control over the folks who post there, so, therefore, he didn't send any troops. Glad we are all clear on that.
   Meanwhile, tomorrow morning, 11am PDT is another chance for ol' Doug C. or CatholicDude or GAssisi or any of the other "My I am brave behind a keyboard but please, please, please don't ask me to actually defend my slanderous writings since I can't really do that and I know it" folks to back up their claims in the only venue that matters: one where the truth can be told. The number is 877-753-3341. I'll be here, waiting. :-)

15:39:16 - Category: Roman Catholicism - Link to this article -


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More from the Catholic Web-Board World

04/08/2005 - James White

   Sometimes, you just have to shake your head. Remember Doug C. from Houston, who launched into me on Steve Ray's board? Here's the original, here's my reply to his letter, also posted on Ray's board. Now, if you haven't ever ventured into Steve Ray's web-board, let's just say it is well known for two things: 1) hotheads, 2) massive volume. I have a vague recollection of actually posting on it briefly, years ago. I could be wrong, but I have a memory of sitting in the Denver airport on my laptop attempting to find time to keep up with a discussion on that board with one of the female regulars regarding, if I recall correctly, Irenaeus' view of tradition, or something like that. In any case, I just checked to see if anything more had been said regarding the fact that the letter Doug C. posted really had nothing whatsoever to do with his original slanderous and false statements. The first response, from "Donna," provides this insight: ...
[Click Here to Continue Reading]

20:50:31 - Category: Roman Catholicism - Link to this article -


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Documenting the Apostasy

04/08/2005 - James White

   One of the first things I said last week regarding the death of John Paul II was, "Sit back and start taking notes. How many, anywhere, even in 'Christian media,' will address the only relevant issue regarding the death of John Paul II?" I was such an optimist! I hadn't yet realized that not only would the gospel be ignored, it would be thrown under the bus. Well, maybe I should rephrase that. You can't throw something under the bus that you don't possess, and evidently, a very, very large portion of "evangelicalism" surely does not count the cross, the resurrection, justification, faith, atonement, substitution---sola gratia, sola fide, solus Christus, soli Deo gloria---as something "precious." In fact, they act as if they've never even heard of it.
   The Cooperative Baptist Fellowship is a splinter group from the Southern Baptist Convention. I was just directed to "Pope John Paul II - A Baptist Response" found here. Some of the more revealing comments: ...
[Click Here to Continue Reading]

20:22:04 - Category: Roman Catholicism - Link to this article -


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Campi Steps Out Front to Take a Few Tomatos (Tomatoes? Tohmatohs?)

04/08/2005 - James White

   My bud Campi (Steve Camp), never one to shy away from controversy (hey, the guy can make me cringe, and that's not easy to do!), has stepped out front to take a few of the incoming...rotten vegetables aimed the direction of the few of us who have simply refused to compromise the Gospel and jump onto the "I may be a Protestant but he was my Pope too" bandwagon. Here's his article.

17:06:27 - Category: Roman Catholicism - Link to this article -


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Giving a Pass?

04/08/2005 - James White

   I have had a few folks write to me and ask why I gave Dr. Al Mohler a "pass" in the blog article on the Dobson program. While I did not mention Dr. Mohler's participation in the program by name (which, given that there were two priests and Dobson, did not amount to a major portion of the show), I did say that the position of the program was set in its opening comments, and there was really nowhere to go as far as the truth was concerned at that point. Since Dobson closed the door on the reality of the situation at the start, it was simply painful to hear Dr. Mohler attempt to say anything meaningful in an already compromised situation. Since it had already been established that the gospel was off the table as far as defining the faith, what more could be said? Dr. Mohler is on the board of Focus on the Family. The issue of Rome's gospel should have been dealt with in that context, not the context of a national radio program with two Roman Catholic priests on the line. Hence I did focused solely upon the real issue: the fact that a large portion of "evangelicals" have concluded, not by serious reflection upon the gospel itself but due to social and cultural concerns alone, that all the additions to the gospel that are reflected in Rome's teachings, and embraced by John Paul II in his life and teachings and practice, do not in fact vitiate the gospel, but amount just to "differences" that are not definitional. The gospel has been whittled down to the LCD (remember that from school? Least Common Denominator) of "Jesus." Don't try to ask who Jesus is; don't ask what He did. Just as long as a person "believes in Jesus," all is well.
   I personally appreciate what Dr. Mohler has said on his blog. He has a massive audience, so I can just imagine the response he has gotten for attempting to bring any kind of biblical thinking to the topic. I will never be asked to be on boards and do the things he is doing or has done, so I have it "easy." We are a small ministry because 1) I'm not bright enough to have a big one and 2) the bigger you get the more you have to think about "constituencies." I can say what I need to say when I need to say it, and for that, I'm thankful.

11:25:39 - Category: Roman Catholicism - Link to this article -


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A Sample of Roman Catholic "Apologetics" in Action

04/07/2005 - James White

   I just read through this thread, and once again, I am simply left speechless. Obviously, what we do in apologetics just isn't intended for most of these folks. Put on your asbestos gloves prior to clicking this URL, and thanks to the couple of non-Catholics who took the time to say, "Uh, wait a minute, that's just silly...." BTW, to all the people on that thread: it never, ever, ever crossed my mind that Ray closed down his forum because of me, and only the most extremely bigotted mind could possibly find in my words any indication I was suggesting such a thing. I think I should re-think even inviting "CatholicDude" to call the program, for it seems rather clear, reading through that thread, that nothing would be accomplished by even attempting to speak to him. Sad, once again, very sad. I can only trust that others observe this kind of attitude and go, "Wait, that's wrong---so why are my fellow Catholics so afraid of this man, and why is it they have to so clearly misrepresent everything he says? Why is there no substance in their replies, but only bravado-filled dismissals?" That is what makes it worthwhile! The Lord has His way of making all things work to the good, as the Word says.

19:42:35 - Category: Roman Catholicism - Link to this article -


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What a Difference a Blog Makes

04/07/2005 - James White

   You may recall that yesterday I noted the kind words of one Doug C. from Houston:
   Second, Tim Staples told me that White got his clocked cleaned by a friend of his in a debate on Peter being the rock. After the debate, White admitted that he had to uphold his anticatholic position or he has no ministry.
   White is a master spin doctor and a very prideful man. A very good friend of mine (she's excatholic) was actually friends with him. She attended one of his debates in California and she approached him a few days later, asking why he was so arrogant and rude during the debate, and why he kept changing the subject. He told her not to speak to him again.
   Now, these are not kind words (let alone that they are unfounded rumor and simply dishonest). So I invited Doug C. to call in on The Dividing Line to substantiate his rumor-mongering. Well, just a little while ago, johnMark, who seems to spend a large portion of his life surfing the net for interesting things, pointed me to a letter from Doug C. to myself. I don't know about anyone else, but if I didn't see the name attached to the following letter, I would have a hard time thinking the same person wrote it. What a difference having your obviously unguarded words posted on a well-read blog makes! ...
[Click Here to Continue Reading]

12:00:00 - Category: Roman Catholicism - Link to this article -


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How to Remove the Gospel from the Center

04/07/2005 - James White

   James Dobson of Focus on the Family had a program featuring two Roman Catholic priests in memory of Pope John Paul II (4/6/05). The program started out all wrong, as Dobson said, and this is a quote,
His impact on people everywhere has been profound, and there are many areas wherein we found common cause with him and the other Catholic leaders. I'm a Protestant, and most of our listeners know that, I think, and I do have significantly theological differences with my Catholic brothers and sisters, but I'm grateful, and I say this with great meaning, I'm grateful for the moral force of Pope John Paul and especially his advocacy for the culture of life rather than the culture of death which has us by the neck here in the United States and other places around the world.
   Once again, there is everything good about standing for life, whether a Catholic, Protestant, Jew, Hindu, Buddhist, Muslim, or plain old pagan. But you will note that Dobson laid the foundation of the rest of the program right at the start. Some might think it is wonderful that Dobson raised the issue of theological differences. Then again, don't we all have theological differences, even between the closest friends? Reformed Baptists have a "theological difference" with their Presbyterian brothers on the issue of baptism (paedobaptism vs. credobaptism, baptism of covenant children vs. baptism of disciples alone), but that is all just "in the family" is it not? Theological disagreements are a dime a dozen.
   What Dr. Dobson did by raising the "theological disagreements" between "Protestants" and Roman Catholics in the context he did was to remove the gospel from the definition of Christianity. How so? Well, he referred to our "Catholic brothers and sisters." There's the issue. If they are our brothers and sisters, then the gospel does not define who our brothers and sisters in the Christian faith are. Now, I truly doubt Dr. Dobson holds to the Federal Vision view of covenantal baptism that made up the substance of my debate with Doug Wilson last year, so I doubt he is using the term in the nuanced fashion it is used by FVists. And since it seemed to me, listening to the program, that the faith of the Pontiff, and his acceptance into the presence of God based upon the orthodox understanding of Roman Catholic theology and practice, was a given, it seems obvious that Dobson views Catholics as fellow Christians, heirs of grace, outside the proper realm of "evangelization." The Roman gospel of the Mass and Mary and purgatory saves, it seems, according to Focus on the Family, or, at least, James Dobson. And having set that tone, what came after could hardly change it.
   I likewise note the fact that one of the two priests on the program, Frank Pavone, is involved in the Roman Catholic apologetics movement. In fact, he will be on the Catholic Answers cruise in November (along with Michael Medved). That means he is hardly one of those Roman Catholics who is going to say that Protestant theology is "just fine." It would be nice if there had been a real debate on that program between Pavone and a Protestant who would stand firm and say, "No, I'm sorry, as much as common grace led John Paul II to do things that are moral and 'good' from a human perspective, the gospel he embraced, and his dedication to Mary, is completely inconsistent with the Christian faith." But that would have been pretty hard, given Dr. Dobson's opening lines.

07:00:00 - Category: Roman Catholicism - Link to this article -


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Now THIS Speaks Louder Than Words

04/06/2005 - James White

   
This image expresses what I have been trying to say for a few days now. This image appears in rotating fashion at www.catholic.com, the Catholic Answers website. A number of years ago I wrote the following in my book, Mary--Another Redeemer?:
It is general knowledge that Pope John Paul II is highly devoted to the Virgin Mary. He credits Mary with saving him from an assassin's bullet early on in his pontificate. His personal motto, inscribed upon his blue-and-white coat of arms, Totus Tuus sum Maria, means Mary, I am totally yours. He has visited just about every Marian shrine in the world, and has done much to revive and foster Marian devotion in the Roman Church.
   John Paul II's devotion to Mary, especially his belief in her as co-redemptrix, co-mediatrix, and advocate for the people of God, portrayed in this image (which, I am told, has appeared not only on the Catholic Answers website, but others as well), illustrates perfectly what I am talking about when I speak of how Rome's gospel gets in the way of Christ. Remember the words of Liguori in The Glories of Mary:
On this account it was, says St. Bernard, that the Eternal Father, wishing to show all the mercy possible, besides with giving us Jesus Christ, our principal advocate him, was pleased also to give us Mary, as our adwith Jesus Christ. There is no doubt,the saint adds, that Jesus Christ is the only mediator of justice between men and God; that, by virtue of his own merits and promises, he will and can obtain us pardon and the divine favors; but because men acknowledge and fear the divine Majesty, which is in him as God, for this reason it was necessary to assign us another advocate, to whom we might have recourse with less fear and more confidence, and this advocate is Mary, than whom we cannot find one more powerful with his divine majesty, or one more merciful towards ourselves. The saint says, Christ is a faithful and powerful Mediator between God and men, but in him men fear the majesty of God. A mediator, then, was needed with the mediator himself; nor could a more fitting one be found than Mary. (pp. 195-196)
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17:43:36 - Category: Roman Catholicism - Link to this article -


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The Most Pathetic Post I've Ever Seen...

04/05/2005 - James White

   ...at least from an "apologist." This just appeared on Dave Armstrong's blog. You remember Dave Armstrong. Yes, he's the fellow who kept stealing Angel's artwork, having a four-year old butcher it, and posting it on his blog. Same fellow who melted down into a puddle of apologetic goo when I finally invested the time to start working through his book, The Catholic Verses, and that after years of wanting to "debate" me in writing (but, of course, never in person). Same fellow who then took an oath to stop interacting with "anti-Catholics" (convenient use of terminology)---which had the not overly unexpected result of basically killing his blog, which then went into hibernation during Lent anyway. And so now what do I find but a listing of my books and their Amazon sales ranks compared to who else, but DA! Honestly, how utterly pathetic can someone become? It was bad enough that his work was shown to be consistently shallow, and worse that his attempts to respond were shrill and panic-filled (leading to his melt down and his unwillingness to even attempt further defense), but evidently he was stewing a good deal more than anyone knew to stoop this low. Of course, there's a little problem: Amazon is not a major outlet for my works. My own ministry, other Christian ministries, and bookstores (including academic ones: a number of my works are used as textbooks in various Bible schools and seminaries) make up the majority of my distribution. Now, I don't personally care if Mr. Armstrong does in fact outsell me: the Prayer of Jabez sold more books than I will ever sell in my entire lifetime, and it remains a vapid waste of paper. But it truly amazes me that someone who utterly lacks the tools to do the work he claims to do with such expertise continues to be dragged along by the rest of his compatriots. Just another example of "as long as it is in the service of Mother Church, it is all good." What a contrast: we seek to be consistent in honor of the truth, which at times requires us to speak to less-than-popular topics (such as our exposure of the many errors of Dave Hunt). Where is that kind of consistent dedication to truth on the "Roman" side?

21:14:55 - Category: Roman Catholicism - Link to this article -


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Insight Into the Roman Catholic Mind

04/04/2005 - James White

   The posting of my sermon from yesterday (here in Real Audio, but it is on our mp3 page as well) has generated an incredible response, both positively and negatively. Combined with the blog entries over the past few days, our incoming e-mail has been hot and heavy. But so also have been the Roman Catholic web boards. While Steve Ray shut his down, the Catholic Answers forums and those at Envoy Magazine remain open. It is indeed a fascinating contrast to compare what I have written and said over the past few days (and will discuss tomorrow on the DL, inviting all of these Roman Catholics who are so very...vocal...on web boards to call and explain their accusations directly to me) with the responses I have garnered. While I have focused upon the gospel, my detractors have focused upon...me, of course. While hardly one of them has ever met me, and are doing nothing but repeating unfounded rumors, they are certain that their ad-hominem just must be true. How else can you explain someone who has been so consistent over the years? While John Paul II's consistency in his beliefs indicates he was great, my consistency indicates I am arrogant. While John Paul's focus upon Mary means he is spiritual, my focus upon the gospel means I'm hard-hearted. Well, you just can't win for trying, I guess.
   Here's an example from the Catholic Answers forums from a "Catholic Dude":
   I dont understand your deep rooted hatred for the pope in such hours of pain and suffering? There will come a time when your on your death bed, is the pope going to laugh at you, and trash you like you do? When your wife or kids is suffering are Catholic papers going to smile, the way you do at such suffering?
   The pope speaks to the world, and has done what he could to promote peace. The Catholic Church is the ONLY church screaming about abortion, and the Pope made that very clear it is one of the gravest evils of our time. Do you guys care? NO! Go and clap your hands while the True Church is feeding the hungry, giving housing, schools, running orphanages, disaster reliefe, etc. YOU HAVE DONE ZERO TO PROMOTE THE GOSPEL. GREED IS ALL YOU KNOW. All you do is run a company to make money for yourself, all in the name of Jesus. Your nothing but a buisiness man selling your version of Chirstianity, you have no history, no respect. In the end you have no future.
   Who stood up for Terri? THE CATHOLICS, to you Prots she was a nothing, you prots didnt care. You Prots are destroying Christianity, every day more and more divisions, look at you how old is your made up self appointed excuse for a church. Read this to your congregation to show how evil us Catholics are, I dare you, read the whole thing in front of them. Highlight the part about spreading the Gospel to the poor, and you spreading the wealth to your pocketbook.
   In the end who are you...your a nobody, no voice, you will be forgotten. Catholics are the ONLY group who respect life and stand up for it.
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17:27:34 - Category: Roman Catholicism - Link to this article -


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The Gospel and John Paul II

04/04/2005 - James White

   Yesterday morning I chose to "take the risk," scrap the message I had been prepared to deliver, and speak to the folks at Cornerstone Baptist Church about the gospel and John Paul II. Not knowing the congregation, it truly was a bit of a gamble, but the fine folks I had talked to gave me the confidence to go through with it. The gathered believers not only received the message with great interest and attentiveness, but this morning their sound man, Glen, contacted us and provided us with the sound file of the sermon itself. I really appreciate the timely manner in which Glen provided us with this sermon. Click here to listen in Real Audio format, or, if you'd rather, we have placed it on our mp3 page as well.

09:11:01 - Category: Roman Catholicism - Link to this article -


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The Wonderful World of NSA

04/03/2005 - James White

   A certain set of folks will surely chalk this up to my innate stupidity, blindness, and general lack of in-depth knowledge of the sewing methods of French nuns in the northwestern corner of France in the year 1219, but I just read Peter Leithart's comments on the death of John Paul II, and I am once again launched off into the netherworld of utter confusion brought on by "reformed Catholicism." I'm sure it is very "broad minded" to speak this way, but honestly, I just don't get it. Here's the final paragraph of the commentary:
Flawed though his theology was, he remains far and away the greatest Christian leader of the past century. No Protestant comes anywhere close. Billy Graham may have preached more (maybe!), but Graham had nowhere near the political weight or the theological depth of Pope John Paul II. John Paul II's life is not only testimony to the wonders that God can perform through imperfect instruments but an inspiration for all Christians, whether or not we aspire to pope.
   Let me see if I can figure this out. What makes a great Christian leader has nothing to do with the gospel. It has to do with political weight and theological depth. I guess it follows that "theological depth" is also disconnected from the gospel, too. You can be "deep" theologically without having any depth at all regarding such topics as the sovereignty of God in salvation, God's self-glorification in salvation, justification by grace through faith, the cross, atonement, substitution, the imputation of righteousness, forgiveness, the nature of adoption, sanctification, glorification...well, it would be easier to just say "the entirety of soteriology, ecclesiology, and the vast majority of eschatology." I guess that leaves theology proper, and ethics, as the realms of John Paul's "depth." But, oddly enough, I don't think you can be "deep" in either if 1) you don't see how God's triune nature is involved in the gospel itself, and 2) you can't do ethics outside of a proper view of man and God that again involves the gospel. So I'm at a loss as to what this "theological depth" is all about. But I'm just a Baptist, so that is probably just a given anyway. ...
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23:14:00 - Category: Roman Catholicism - Link to this article -


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Steve Ray Sends the Troops

04/02/2005 - James White

   I arrived in Detroit from speaking at the Toledo Conference and I get a text message from our massive AOMin headquarters high atop the AOMin towers (uh, yeah), "The hate mail is pouring in." Seems one of my comments from yesterday was posted on the Steve Ray "Catholic Convert" message board. Now, if you've ever visited that web-board, you know that many of the folks who frequent it are...less than...subtle, shall we say? And so the hate mail has indeed been pouring in. Of course, none of it even tries to deal with the issues I have raised, but what do you expect from hate mail anyway? Though I have stayed focused upon the issues raised, the gospel, etc., these folks know nothing but ad-hominem and insult. Says much about what fills the heart, to be sure. So I popped on over to the web-board, and found it to be filled with all sorts of fair, even-handed, theological comments, like this one from Doug C. in Houston:
   Second, Tim Staples told me that White got his clocked cleaned by a friend of his in a debate on Peter being the rock. After the debate, White admitted that he had to uphold his anticatholic position or he has no ministry.
   White is a master spin doctor and a very prideful man. A very good friend of mine (she's excatholic) was actually friends with him. She attended one of his debates in California and she approached him a few days later, asking why he was so arrogant and rude during the debate, and why he kept changing the subject. He told her not to speak to him again.
   Just a note for ol' Doug. Twice a week I do a webcast called The Dividing Line. The number is toll-free, 877-753-3341. Next one will be Tuesday morning, 11am PDT. How about having the integrity to call? What you are doing above is called rumor-mongering. It is also called "lying." I'll be looking for your call, or, if you can't make it during the morning, try Thursday, 4pm PDT, which should be about 6pm your time. In either case, I look forward to your having the integrity to attempt to back up your rumors. :-) ...
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19:44:54 - Category: Roman Catholicism - Link to this article -


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Thoughts On the Death of John Paul II

04/02/2005 - James White

   Sit back and start taking notes. How many, anywhere, even in "Christian media," will address the only relevant issue regarding the death of John Paul II? And that issue?
   Well, it isn't the length of his Pontificate, one of the longest and most stable in centuries.
   It isn't the fact that as far as Pontiffs go, he was a great administrator, traveler, even uniter of a very factionalized church. His "greatness" as a Pope isn't an issue.
   It won't be that he was a nice man, or that he took courageous stands on controversial issues.
   No, the issue almost no one will speak about is very simple: the gospel of Jesus Christ. It will not be spoken of for the simple reason that very, very few today believe the gospel can be known with sufficient clarity and depth to even address the issue of Rome's teaching. Further, many do not believe one must believe almost anything beyond a very basic, basic summary of Christian beliefs, hence, since the Pope "believed in Jesus," they will ignore the specifics of Rome's teachings and pass him directly into heaven without the first thought of what the New Testament as a whole teaches on the subject (proving that many today fear men rather than God, and do not care at all about the sanctity of His truth).
   As I have noted on the Dividing Line, the passing of John Paul II opens up a tremendous opportunity for dialogue. Are you prepared? Can you address the issue of the Papacy, the sufficiency of Scripture, and the reality of the gospel of Jesus Christ and how Rome does not possess that gospel (but instead dogmatically denies it)? The mp3 files available on this website, providing debates on all of these issues, would assist you greatly. The Roman Catholic Controversy would assist you as well.
   Please remember that many Roman Catholics today have known no Pope but John Paul II. They have a very, very strong attachment to him on a personal level. Your task is to be gentle yet direct in your seeking to proclaim God's truth to Roman Catholics. You can address the Papacy without addressing John Paul II individually. But the better you know your faith, and the better you know the teachings of Rome, the more confidence you will have in addressing this topic.
   I will address the issue of the Papacy and the death of the Pope when I return to Phoenix and get the chance to do the Dividing Line on Tuesday morning, 11am PDT, 2pm EDT.

13:02:40 - Category: Roman Catholicism - Link to this article -


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Pat Robertson Lauds the Pope

04/01/2005 - James White

   I just listened to Pat Robertson throw the gospel in the trash heap. The stampede to make sure the gospel is utterly irrelevant to salvation is on. Watch as evangelicals go on record as non-Protestants.

19:19:56 - Category: Roman Catholicism - Link to this article -


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The Pope to Be an Intercessor?

04/01/2005 - James White

   A Vatican official just said that we need an intercessor in heaven who understands the problems of the 21st century on earth. He was talking about John Paul II going to heaven to be an intercessor.
   I assure that official that the Lord Jesus knows all about the troubles of the 21st century.

13:17:18 - Category: Roman Catholicism - Link to this article -


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Peace

04/01/2005 - James White

   We are hearing a great deal about the Pope dying in peace. And for what reason? Because he has suffered. You will be able to see, and hear, just how badly understood the gospel is amongst evangelicals and others as you listen to the commentary on the Pope. The specifics of the gospel will be buried under the emotionalism of death. The Pope's salvation will be guaranteed not because his faith is fixed solely upon the finished work of Christ (which, in light of the devotion to Mary, belief in the Mass, purgatory, etc., it clearly is not), but because of his suffering, his "goodness," a goodness not determined by reference to God's holiness, of course, but by reference to other men.
   I wonder...how many evangelical leaders will honor God rather than men and say what needs to be said? "Unless the Pope believed the gospel, he, like any other person on the planet, died under the wrath of God, outside of the only way of salvation God has provided in Jesus Christ!" And how many will cave in to the fear of the face of men and do what society demands by compromising the gospel, showing a greater love of the acclaim of men rather than the approval of God? Remember, friends:

Romans 5:1 Therefore, having been justified by faith, we have peace with God through our Lord Jesus Christ.


13:02:20 - Category: Roman Catholicism - Link to this article -


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Reports on the Pope's Death

04/01/2005 - James White

   As most of you know, various news sources are reporting Pope John Paul II has died, while others, including the Vatican, are denying this. However, the Vatican has confirmed that he is dying, and that it is only a matter of time. I am in Toledo, Ohio, preparing to speak this evening at the Toledo Reformed Theology Conference, so I am watching the coverage at Fox News, and it is truly fascinating.
   It is truly amazing to listen to them promoting Mary as Mediatrix, the Rosary, etc., and, of course, he is being passed directly into the presence of God with no stops in purgatory. In fact, one of the commentators (Monsignor Lisante) said that John Paul must have released many from purgatory due to his own sufferings (see how relevant the topics have been in our debate series on Long Island?). It is truly amazing to observe and even sadder to realize that so few of those who are hearing this have any idea what is being said or what it means.
   Now a Vatican representative is saying that Mary has opened wide the door to heaven to John Paul, who dedicated himself to Mary (a reference to the Papal motto, Totus tuus, "totally yours," addressed not to Jesus, but to Mary). If you are likewise watching, do not hold your breath waiting to hear about repentance from sin, the perfection of the work of Christ, the imputed righteousness of Christ. But you will hear much of Mary, far more than of Jesus. The true faith of Rome is on display in this situation. American Roman Catholic apologists seek to diminish the centrality of Mary in Roman theology, but here you see how foundational Mary is to the piety of the leadership of the Roman Catholic Church in Rome itself.
   I will continue blogging live observations as time allows until I have to leave to speak this evening.

12:22:00 - Category: Roman Catholicism - Link to this article -


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